Jeremy Clarkson
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From
October 14, 2007
Fiat Bravo
Call me stupid, but I like it
The new Highway Code is full of many worthy and ethnically balanced tips for making the world a greener and safer place. You can’t smoke. You can’t leave your engine running unnecessarily. You can’t apply make-up if it’s been tested on cats. And if you must eat at the wheel, make it a biodegradable pot of fairtrade hummus and not some corporate ghastliness like a Big Mac. There are also many rules for the elderly. Motorised wheelchairs, it says, should be driven on the pavement wherever possible, at no more than 4mph. And if the driver does have to venture on to the road, he or she should think about wearing a high-visibility jacket, especially when negotiating roundabouts.
Strangely, however, the vegetarian lunatic who wrote all this guff has no specific advice for older people who have not yet got themselves a Stannah stairlift on wheels. The three score and tenners who still have a car. I do, though. And here it is. Get a bloody move on.
I want to make it absolutely plain at this point that I have no beef against the older generation. They fought Hitler. They invented coal. They made a quarter of the world pink while eating nothing but cabbage. And I’m grateful for all that. But if we delivered your meals on wheels at the speed you drive, you’d end up with botulism.
There are no depths to which my shoulders will not sink when I happen upon a spotlessly clean Peugeot – and it is almost always a Peugeot – that is being coaxed along the highways and byways by someone whose ears are so big he can use them to pick up the shopping channels.
Of course, the poor old chap is in no rush. He has spent his life relentlessly dodging Nazis and diphtheria. He has worked his fingers to the bone for 40 years. And now he’s retired, he can slow right down. Potter to the potting shed. Take his time. Relax.
Hmmm. If you are Japanese or French, then this is undoubtedly the case, because you will live until you are a hundred and forty-twelve. But here in Britain, the average life expectancy for a man is 77. So, if you are 70 now, there is no time to lose.
No really. If you only have seven years left, that means the Reaper will be dropping round for tea and buns in about 61,000 hours from now. You therefore shouldn’t be wasting time by pootling to the garden centre at walking pace. So come on, grandad. The clock’s ticking. Pedal to the metal. Or you’ll be in your flowerbed before the plants you bought.
I was particularly distressed by a piece of geriatric driving last weekend since it was my eldest daughter’s first leave-out from boarding school and I wanted to be there on time. Unfortunately, she has made it crystal clear that I am never – never, d’you hear – to pick her up in any car that is even slightly flamboyant or flash. Nothing with four-wheel drive. Nothing with only two seats. Nothing with a big snarling engine. Nothing yellow. And as a result, I was tootling up the Fosse Way in a placenta red Fiat Bravo.
It was the sporty version, I’m afraid, but even so, it simply didn’t have enough oomph to get past the inevitable Peugeot. Which meant I arrived at the school late. Thanks, Mr Molehusband. I hope you have a big-end failure very soon. And because you chose a Peugeot, you probably will.
And speaking of unreliability . . . I honestly cannot work out how Fiat is still in business. British Leyland failed because it made rubbish cars, essentially for the home market. And yet – somehow – Fiat has been doing exactly the same thing for years but is still with us.
Yes, it survived in Italy because its market was protected from imports. But it isn’t now. And anyway, because it costs a billion to develop a new car, Fiat has to sell its products all over the world. Which means someone in Britain has to think: “Yes. There are many great cars out there, all of which suit my needs perfectly. But I’m not interested in speed, style, reliability, fuel economy, performance or value. So I shall buy a Punto.” Every single time you read a customer satisfaction survey, all the Fiats sit down at the bottom. Above Peugeot for sure, but often below Citroën and even Renault. And for Fiat to survive it has to reckon these disgruntled customers will say: “My Punto is terrible. I hate it. It is always going wrong. So I shall buy another.” The thing is, however, that somehow Fiat does survive, and I’m extremely glad because I like what it makes very much.
You get in a Fiat and even though the headlining has fallen off, and is draped round your head like a nun’s hat, and the engine sounds as if it’s being fuelled with gravel and there’s a smell of melting glue, you always think: “This is fun.”
It’s much the same story with the new Bravo. It’s available with a wide range of engines but inevitably, I asked for the most powerful. It’s a turbocharged 1.4 that chucks out 150bhp. That’s a lot from a small amount of space. But it doesn’t feel like half enough when you’re on the Fosse and you can’t see what’s coming the other way because your view is blocked by the ridiculous ears of the man in front.
Maybe because it’s quite a porker, it really isn’t a fast car. So in desperation, you press a little button on the dash that says “sport”.
Fiat says this changes the shape of the engine’s torque curve. Instead of getting a dribble, low down in the rev range, you get a torrent coming on stream at 3000rpm. Hmmm. Having experimented with this button on a number of occasions, I’ve decided that what it actually does is illuminate a little light on the dash. And that’s it.
I don’t care, though, because it is a fun car to drive. There’s a looseness to the controls that you may interpret as poor build quality or a slackness in the system, and I’d be the first to agree that the steering’s not that great and the handling isn’t especially noteworthy. However, somehow, it puts a smile on your face. Maybe it’s because it feels so very, very different to a taut and muscular Volkswagen.
It looks different, too. I was going to wax lyrical about how the Italians, even when they’re asked to come up with a practical five-door hatchback, somehow manage to give it a bit of flair, a bit of panache. But then I noticed it was designed by a man called Frank Stephenson. Who sounds about as Italian as a Fray Bentos steak and kidney pie. Whatever. It’s a lovely looking little thing with a stylish nose and tapering windows. I think you would feel fairly pleased to have one sitting on your drive. Inside, it’s pretty much the same as all the other cars in the world, except for one thing. I could never quite get comfortable. Italian cars always used to be designed for creatures that are only found under rocks in the sea, and while they’ve got better, they still refuse to accept that a human being’s legs are usually longer than his arms.
Other things. Well, you can have it with a voice-activated sat nav system, which won’t work, and will then break. And my test car came with a USB connection port for an MP3 player. Lovely, except it appeared to have been put in place by an ape.
There’s no point going on. There are many issues in a Bravo that you just won’t find in a Volkswagen. So we’re back to square one. To buy this car you must decide that what you really want is something that’s not quite as good as a Golf.
Except for a couple of things. The way it feels and the way it looks. If these are important to you, try one. You might like it. I did.
I also liked the huge ashtray. It was easily big enough to hold the ashes of a freshly burnt copy of our ridiculous new Highway Code.
Vital statistics
Model Fiat Bravo 1.4 TJet 150 Sport
Engine 1368cc, four cylinders
Power 150bhp @ 5500rpm
Torque 170 lb ft @ 3000rpm
Transmission Six-speed manual
Fuel 39.8mpg (combined cycle)
CO2 167g/km
Acceleration 0-62mph: 8.5sec
Top speed 131mph
Price £14,795
Rating 
Verdict Fun with foibles
I had a Fiat Bravo HGT for 6 years - the best car I ever owned. Not one thing went wrong for all that time, and the engine sounded great. Incredible value, and looked fantastic.
My parents had a golf, and had no end of problems with it.
M.H, Surrey,
I am driving new Fiat Bravo, 1.4 T-jet. There is nothing you can really compare with this car (same category). Design, performance and pleasure driving it, keeps smile on your face. If you try it, you will buy it!
Nik, Nicosia, Cyprus
I have owned two Volkswagen Golf's from new and both had engines problems of which the abysmal VW dealer network could not resolve and what work they did complete was charged at a rediculous rate. I had a Fiat Stilo Abarth for 4 troublefree years... Fiat wins for me.
Geoff Haddock Birmingham UK
Geoff Haddock, Birmingham, West Midlands
Ive owned both a volkswagen, and a fiat. To me, the fiat wins on all fronts. Style, reliability, drive quality and above all, you really enjoy the drive. LONG LIVE THE BRAVO
Lee Smith, New Romney, Kent
Its all about how a car makes you feel. Fiat cars are enigmatic and interesting, generally cheap to buy, usually fast enough, and so much more likeable than fords, vauxhalls and the like. I get 44 mpg from my punto.(petrol) Big cars are finished, its coming and we all know it.
John Clement, Leeds, UK
I am looking forward to taking delivery of my new Bravo next week! After 7 very happy trouble free years of motoring with my 'old' 2001 Bravo which has done 106,000 miles and still has the original clutch and exhaust (only changes have been tyres, breaks and belts!) all I can say is - bring it on!
Yvonne Mayne, Welling, England
Make no mistake the bravo is a very impressive car and so much more refined than My Audi A4 1.9 TDI 130hp. It is a very nice and quiet place to spend many hours a day in. So sad I have to give it back. Pity it's not a little bigger. Pity VAG can't make a 1.6 Diesel engine as good as this.
Mark, Kildare, Ireland
I never had any probs with my '96 Fiat Brava. The doors also clunked with more of a clunk than my (suzuki made) Fiat Sedici. So much for Japanese quality.
Richard Hall, London, UK
Hi Jeremy, I a great fan of yours. As an Italian, I do not think your review is objective. It is true FIAT was going to miserably fail if it was not thanks to the Italian government to protect it. However I can say they make good cars, easy to drive and extremely reliable (my family always had one).
Giuseppe, Edinburgh, Midlothian
Jeremy you forgot to leave big ears plate number so I can find him and take him for a spin.
Jack Ripper
P.S. I love how the BRAVO looks.
Brumaru Gabriel Robert, reykjavik, iceland
I own a 1999 bravo and i've done 130.000 km.
I have never had a problem with reliability and
nothing has fallen off it's place.
My next car will be a fiat for sure!
dimitris, trikala, greece
Jeremy,
As always you are correct, I've just spent the last 4 weeks wandering around showroom after showroom like a hobbit with a limp trying to find his precious.... Like alot of people I've had my fun with my tomb raider like land rover scooping up the dales like chunks of ben and jerries and whizzing round the backroads pretending to be a rally driver thus ending up spending several hours talking to live stock waiting for the D.A.D rescue service and a flask of hot tea. It was time to stop giving all my money away on internal combustion fluid and the dreaded plague that is insurance and get a everyday run of the mill car, that's right a car... I test drove all sorts, some of which looked very nice to the eye but were lacking any inner heart. It was then that a friend of mine suggested the New Fiat Bravo, I thought for a bit and what the hell... I'm glad I went, yes it's not the most fantastic thing you'll drive but it has feel and character. That's all one needs.
Mark Fuller, Derby, Derbyshire
the problem is that clarkson thinks everybody has is money to drive around in chunky volvos and expensive aston martin, i've recently part exchange a jaguar for the new fiat bravo and iam very happy, its fast very comfy, good equipment and very sporty for a little 14.995 even drives like a 3.00 litre, good for the italians and all the best for the italians.
joe da costa, st helier, jersey
Jeremy,
Your right, the new bravo is a lovely little car. But! maybe because it is italian? it doesn't work properly.
I've just given a hired one back because i look out the of the house in the morning to see the car has all it's windows open and the doors unlocked!
Give me something german any day.
S, Nottingham,
You know what Jeremy?
You can't spend your time driving a Fiat Bravo, or a Peugeot xxx, or a Renault Clio and so on........ You get nervous..
You are made to arrive close to Venice in the evening, driving a Ferrari F430 spider, where a private boat is waiting for you, to bring you in Piazza S. Marco to drink a glass of white wine (a Muller thurgau i would say, or a prosecco, surely not a Martini) watching the sunset on the laguna.
After dinner you could be in the right mood to write about a car just made for the common people.
I can tell you that i drive a Subaru Outback, that's a good and honest car, but i still remember, with a smile in my heart, my dear Fiat Uno turbo i.e.
Francesco, Treviso, Italy
Fiat Marea (in Brazil) - was an awful car because it was neither designed for alcohol or petrol. I'm sure with modern tech they could sort this out.
Earlier FIATS were awful as they used Russian steel.
Jeff, Melbourne, Australia - the Russians did they called it the Lada - leave well alone..
The worst small car I've driven has to be the opel corsa. Clio has a fantastic engine but for a big footed fella like me was a comfort nightmare for me - also seat pulld etc looked like they would break after a couple of uses.
Fav small cars are Fiat Uno, Polo to drive. Panda (the boxy one) to look at..
Terry, london,
I own a Punto 75 ELX '94 model with 340.000Km and never disapointed me.Just a pump of petrol (in tank) a pump of break fluid and a water pump is what i have change in those years.I can watch my brother-in-law vw golf with a bottle of oil to add every 2000Km and i lough because he was kidding me for my car.Only now i add about 400cc every 8000km and that not always.Anyway Italians own to their automobile history to give away the "italian car-unreliable".
Just give more quality
vasilis, western greece,
You're not at all stupid Jeremy. On the back of a rave review you gave the original Bravo back in 96 I bought one, a Bravo 1.4 SX and it gave me 5 years of trouble-free and fun motoring. Rember that the next time you're tempted to once again poke fun at Fiat.
Michael Coyle, Dublin, Ireland
I own a Fiat Marea (in Brazil) and a VW Jetta (in the US). I actually like both of them. There are more problems with the Fiat than with the VW. And I am sure a Toyota would have even fewer. Still, I'd take the VW or the Fiat any day...
Felipe Pait, Brookline, MA
I bought a 1998 Fiat Punto 60 second-hand in 2001 and it has been superb. The clutch has a problem which makes it very heavy but it still works and the only other thing that has gone wrong is the sensor for the water temperature which packed up after I drove through a flooded road under a railway bridge in the so-called summer - a Volvo was stalled in the water but I got through OK. The punto has more room inside than other hatchbacks and it is FUN to drive. I live abroad most of the time and use it on trips to UK. I just disconnect the battery when i leave and connect it again when I arrive and it fires up first time every time. I'd certainly look at a Bravo if I need to trade up in future.
Alan, Hong Kong, China
Know what? Fiat has been the market leader (and growing) in my coutry Brazil for the last 6 yrs. Great,really, for me specially who has always had and loved my Fiats (and for putting lame VW down after a market dominance of more than 30 yrs). In Brazil, VW has not had a decent car in 20 yrs, and it still took people another 15 yrs to elect another leader. Great for us and maybe VW will react. Younger guys here all have and respect Fiat. BTW, in my history the only has that's left me stranded was a Clio. And the only one that has has pieces falling off is my totally POS Ford Ka. My Fiats have done neither. Long live the new king!!
Marcelo Vasconcellos, Belo Horizonte, MG, Brazil
Just to add some more detail to Patrick's comment from Oxford - it is specifically an R registration green Rover 214
Pete, Huntingdon,
hi jeremy ! i drive a lovely ! british! mg zr, and i blew one of those silly fiat bravo's, off the road the other day, worst still same as me, was a young driver too, im sure he dropped the gear and slammed his foot down when he realised i was overtaking him!!! anyway to the point id love to hear your view and opinions of the mg zr+ model, 1.4, i personaly love mg's
anthony, wrexham, wales
Anyone driven an Astra? What a CR@P car! I'll think I will stay with my Alfa 75.
Rob, Brum, West Mids
I always quite liked the look of Fiats, and had been toying with the idea of a new Cinquecento until I hired a Diesel Punto in Sicily earlier this year. Although it was almost new ('07 model with 5000 km on the clock) the driver's side electric window had packed up and the B-pillar trim was peeling off. In addition I don't think I've driven a car with such a rough engine since the Mk 2 Fiesta Popular. If Datsun can build cars better in Sunderland there's no excuse.
And for those of you claiming to have run nothing but Italian cars for years - do yourselves a favour and at least try something different!
Tim S, New Haw, Surrey
Hi Jeremy
Love your column. I agree on the look and feel of a fiat - I own a Grande Punto and I love it - a charmer. However, although Fiat don't produce high-end cars, I have always found the quality to be ok. My family has bought 20 or so Fiats in a row - never a problem with them. Great cars, fun and reliable. Please spare me the overpriced and boring german cars.
Rasmus Dyhr Frederiksen, Roskilde, Denmark
eventually the car will get old and the alfa will make more sense. no turbo means it stays about as silky as new. properly maintained, ahem.
SK, Watford,
Oh dear, who woke Harry Cockerham up? At least its good to know the grumpy old man cliche is still alive and kicking in Ascot!
Phil, Reading, Berkshire
I test drove a Bravo 150 bhp diesel and then an Alfa Romeo 159 with the same engine a few days ago.
The Alfa is definately not worth the extra money.
Kevin Watson, Willencourt, France
I drive a Volvo C30, I know, I know, but it is a far superior car to the Bravo and great to drive, diesel and torque included. I've driven a Bravo and while I like the model it is not a patch on the C30. Now, the Alfa, that's another drive.
David Turnbull, London,
Yep, its the two cushions on the parcel shelf that seals your fate................
Always on the A65 Skipton to Kirkby Lonsdale road at the double white line bits (unless its summer then, oh joy, its caravans / caravanettes as well).
Plus there's the habit of a constant lean towards the curly mop in the passenger seat (or maybe its to counteract the G forces).
Mrs Stig, The Dump,
I've driven Fiats for years and they work perfectly. Not the best fuel economy but otherwise fine.
James Dowling, Londonderry, NI
I'm on my 4th Fiat, all of them have been problematic, all have been a nightmare but I keep coming back to them... something in the glue they use perhaps?
They have the looks sorted, the engines are "ok" (although the 8v variants always seem wheezy) but they really need to sort out the pathetic quality control issues when building them and the equally poor levels of service offered by the dealerships around the UK.
Michael C, Leeds,
Laughed out loud at this article. I drove the 2 litre diesel around Tuscany this summer and rattled over the roads in the Bravo. Jeremy ticked all the boxes that I complained about. The engine was rough. Surprisingly for a diesel, the torque was absent on steep hills at low speeds. Interior finish was not solid. So many buttons - all for the radio! One thing missing from the photo at the top of the piece (and my rental upon its return!!) is the plastic skirt under the front bumper to warn you that you're about to beach the car. Mine half fell off. I had a look and noticed it was stapled on!!! Only option was to remove it. Finished with staples...says it all.
Ray, Dublin,
You arrived late for your daughter's event because you set off too late. That should be obvious to anyone of your driving experience. Perhaps it is obvious to you, and perhaps that is why you feel the need to take refuge from this simple truth in silly generalisations about drivers in their seventies, which generalisations are no less silly for being familiar and repeated ad nauseam. I'll be seventy in a couple of months' time. When I am, I'd be happy to drive any route you choose, in the same make and model of family hatchback, same age & mileage, same spec, departing at the same time as you, in any weather. We could then see if you arrived at the destination more than a few minutes ahead of this seventy-year-old, whilst driving all the way with due regard to the road and weather conditions and the safety of others, keeping to all speed limits and driving within the law in every respect. Your boring prejudices against elderly drivers are an insult to your readers' intelligence.
Harry Cockerham, Ascot, United Kingdom
Congratulations, mr Clarkson, for saying tons of rubbish about Italian cars.
Fiat isn't like Leyland because it's a true international company, with a strong presence in South America for example. In Brasil, it's much better than VW.
Fiat's car were inferior until 2003 because of the old director board. Since Marchionne's arrival, the company culture has changed, quality has been pursued and result have arrived. Fifith Guear loved the Cinquecento, Panda was elected the best used car in the UK, Grande Punto became the best selling car in Europe.
Fiat was once the first car maker in Europe. It lost market during the bad administration era. But now Fiat has the new genius of the automotive industry, mr. Marchionne.
It's not like Leyland also because Fiat is the owner of Ferrari, known to many as the best sports cars.
Imagine now a great past (first carmaker in Europe) plus a cutting-edge Ferrari technology plus a strong international presence plus the most brilliant automotive CEO
Edoardo Vattimo, Torino, Italy
Frank Stephenson -- Think new "MINI".
A German mechanic friend of mine had the following painted on his tool box:
"FIAT, a four-letter word starting with F!"
Herman, Indianapolis, USA
I always make a point of reading your articles Jeremy, I find you very entertaining and you often have a point. But i do disagree ever so slightly that we should be speeding up the older generation. I have a grandmother who is going on for 85, and drives like a maniac, she got a speeding ticket a couple of years ago in a clapped out Fiesta, and riding on board is frankly terrifying, especially when she doesn't appear to react to her environment. A comfortable, easy going pace is fine by me, even if you do get stuck behind them once in a while.
A concerned grandson from oxfordshire
A concerned grandson, oxford,
I was driving a hired Fiat Punto. The traffic lights were green for us, not for the guy who breezed across my bow. Jammed the Punto brakes on hard. Long squeal of tyres followed by big bang as the paper salesman (true) approaching fast behind me in his Golf woke up too late. Result: A) one Golf with very mashed front end, winched onto a recovery truck. B) Fiat Punto with not a scratch. No pride of ownership involved with a hired Fiat, but I, the salesman and the policeman were impressed. Very. (As the JC might say).
Tim D, Berlin,
the fiat bravo is a great car.. I drove a 1,4 T-Jet last week and i loved it! it is fast enough,pretty more than enough and well made.I really don't think that the Golf GT with it's poor reliability and boring design is really a better car. I am sick and tired to read about german cars but I don't think that the are so much better than the italians. 159 vs 3 series or Brera vs TT.. give me a break please! I drive a 3,2 Alfa GT and I have so much fun overtaking 330Ci's in every kind of road! I am definetly going to buy a Bravo 1.4 T-jet ! The gruppo is back and next year with the new Lancia Delta things are going to be harder for the germans!
Nikos Koumbis, Elefsina, Greece
Oh come on! Fiats are Crap! they just happen to look good occasionally! ie: New Bambino 500! but things will still fall off.
Mark Robbins, Westcliff on sea, UK
Really Rich - there was lots of Fiat's in Italy ? that's like saying there are lots of Seats in spain !
Daniel, westgate, kent
My grandad drives a 1.3 litre Mazda 323 estate which he seems to think is sporty? Sporty or not, I've never been as terrified in a car and at less than 30 mph to boot.
John Lillis, Glasgow, Scotland
Jeremy, I'm sure you're impressed at your own eloquence (and so are we, some of the time...) but half of what you write about Italian cars is rubbish...i.e. the part where you rubbish them...we have had just Fiats and Lancias in our family since I was a baby and never experienced anything like the headlining fallen off or similar and since 1984 when I have owned my 4 Fiats (Unos and Puntos) and three Lancias (Prisma, Thema, and now Lybra), none have ever let us down, ever! And, Italy has been part of the EU since its inception, so market protection (apart for reciprocating against the Japanese) was not an issue like in the UK where it lingered longer.
Philip Djaferis, Geneva, Switzerland
The old dodderers ALWAYS drive a Rover 200/400 or some kind of Hyundai/Kia in my experience... complete with 2 cushions on rear parcel shelf
Patrick, Oxford,
Rob Preston - your heart sinks when you see someone drive around in a 3-series or a Golf, yet you think a Clio and a 307 (even a cc) have pizazz?! A Cinquecento or a Panda 100 or a Swift Sport maybe but a Clio or a 307?..... oh please!
Roger, Milan,
You don't seem to be in love with Italians, eh....
Damiano Tancredi, Treviso, Italia
"I honestly cannot work out how Fiat is still in business. British Leyland failed because it made rubbish cars, essentially for the home market. And yet – somehow – Fiat has been doing exactly the same thing for years but is still with us."
Fiat is still in business because, whilst Leyland was allowed to go to the wall, Fiat, although a technically private company (owned by the Agnelli family) continued to be bailed out by the Italian government through the leanest years. The opening up of the Italian market to foreign competition was very late (early '90s) and though Fiat market share in Italy dropped sharply the company compensated by picking up market for small cars elsewhere, especially eastern Europe. Foreign firms seized a substantial part of the northern Italian market, but, like Ford in UK, the network of dealers and servicing in the south of the country is still heavily skewed in Fiat's favour.
Once the company got some decent models out (Panda & Punto) the battle was won.
Paolo Bagarino, Roma, Italia
Jeremy - next week, to keep Kevin Watson on France happy, please review a 2CV.
Nick Simmons, Ottawa, Canada
mica or old polished metro round our way
david connor, bognor regis, west sussex
Fiat survies because it is supported by the Italian government!
Bloggs, London, State? Not Drunk!
Must take issue with you here Jeremy : it it not usually a Peugeot being driven by the octogenarian oaf in front - It is always a Nissan Micra Especially if said oaf is female.
Phil Dolman, wirral,
Great review Clarksy. The Italians seem to love them, I saw more than I could count on holiday there this summer.
Rich, london, United Kingdom of great England land
Jeremy is spot on in my opinion.
The whole point of cars is how they make you feel and how they look... My heart always sinks when I see someone driving something terminally dull like a 3 series or a Golf - which admittedly are very good at what they do - when they could have spent the same money on something with more character or pizazz!
My girlfriend had a Punto which had loads of problems, but she loved it...since then she's had a 307cc and a Clio which have a bad reputation but have never let us down (so far) and have some personality! (she calls the Clio "Clive")
Rob Preston, Leeds, England
At last. A car tested we can all afford!
Kevin Watson, Willencourt, France
Bring back the Fiat 124 ! A truly stylish and fun car to drive.
Jeff, Melbourne, Australia